GenShift Transcript: Episode 13—AirForce

Katherine Jeffery: Welcome back to the GenShift podcast. I'm Dr. Katherine Jeffery, if you're new here, this is the space where we slow down, ask better questions, and explore how generations work together with more clarity, flexibility, and relationship. Each episode unpacks what shaped a generation, what they need from leaders in how we can build environments where people feel valued and supported.

Today we're stepping into a fascinating culture, one shaped by precision readiness and a shared mission. We're talking with a member of the United States Air Force, and not just any airman, but a Gen Z airman.

 Today's guest, Brandon represents the next generation of leadership inside the Air Force. In our conversation, he spoke with maturity and insight about communication, trust, stress, and what younger airmen actually need from leaders. He described moments where leadership earned his trust, how feedback works best for him, and what helps a team function when the pressure is real.

He brings a refreshing blend of discipline, self-awareness, and authenticity, and he articulates this Gen Z experience in a way every leader should pay attention to. You're going to learn a lot from him.

Gen Z in the military is incredibly interesting. They grew up with constant connectivity, rapid change, and transparent communication, all shaped long before they ever put on a uniform, and they bring that into a system, built on structure, chain of command and tradition.

Even in a highly disciplined environment like the Air Force, generational differences still show up. How feedback lands, how people interpret authority, what motivates them, and how they actually choose to handle stress.

Hierarchy hits differently depending on the generation Boomers and Gen X grew up with. Rank speaks for itself. Gen Z grew up in a world that expects context clarity and psychological safety. . And that's exactly what we'll explore today through the voice of one, gen Z airman. Brandon, you're not just a Gen Z airman. You are a rock star. Introduce yourself and tell us how you show up in the world.

Brandon: As I mentioned, my name is Brandon and a little context is I come from a military family both my parents are military. I have two siblings from military, so it the military structure, the rank, the hierarchy was something I was exposed to and very familiar with from a young age. As I grew up, I started thinking about what I wanted to do and it ended up leading me to the Air Force Academy. And then after that they sent me to pilot training, and that's where they have me at now.

As I worked to earn my wings and hopefully one day call myself a pilot. 

Katherine Jeffery: Excellent. What are you flying right now? 

Brandon: Right now I'm flying a sim. Haven't made it into the plane yet, so we still got a lot of work to do, but it will be the T six Texan once I've hopefully made it that far.

Katherine Jeffery: Excellent. How much longer do you have to go? 

Brandon: Oh two weeks. 

Katherine Jeffery: Oh, that's not bad. 

Brandon: So two weeks until we hit the plane. It's coming quick. 

Katherine Jeffery: Excellent. 

Brandon: Life is quite hectic at the moment as we get ready for that. 

Katherine Jeffery: And I believe both of your parents are pilots as well. 

Brandon: They are. And so is my brother and my little brother's working on it as well at the moment.

 A family that lives in the air? 

Brandon: Yep. Quite literally. 

Katherine Jeffery: So just tell us real quick, what's it like to be part of Generation Z for you? 

Brandon: Yeah, so one of the things I think of first when I think about my generation is just how quickly everything changes and how quickly we're expected to adapt. In terms of the technology, that one's interesting because we are born into it a little bit depending on your parents, they may have let you embrace it more quickly than others. For example, I didn't quite get into the whole social media thing till high school, so I can remember a little bit of what life was like before that. But then for some others my little brother's just a few years younger.

He doesn't really remember a world before. Instagram and Facebook and all those things. 

And so one one thing that I think about when we start talking about that is just how quickly everything changes and you find out about it immediately too. So you can wake up one morning and something in the world's happened.

You immediately hear about it. And then also the effects of that are felt also pretty immediately. For example, when we talk about just in general changes with societal norms politics regimes those change pretty rapidly. And it's, it, it comes quick. Policy changes, you deal with it immediately.

There's not really grace periods anymore with anything in life. 

Katherine Jeffery: Yeah. Can you think of an example of when you woke up and you're like, oh my gosh, that just happened? 

Brandon: Uh. Yeah. So, My experience with COVID was a bit different from everyone else's. It was probably a little bit easier in some aspects for me 'cause I was in the military at the time and I was also the lowest ranking person in the entire military at the time.

Taking orders was actually quite easy because I don't have a choice regardless of what was going on outside. But it was just in incredible based on who leadership was, what information they had available to them. It's decisions change based on what data you get in the world we live in, how you can get new data every single day.

So one day it's, Hey, here's the policy for today. This is what you're doing with your life. And then the next day they're like, Hey, we just got new data. We have to change, we have to update. You had no idea what your life was gonna look like week to week. 

Katherine Jeffery: Do you feel like you were like having whiplash?

Brandon: A little bit. So this is where I actually, believe I had an easier time than most because I was, that, that, how do I say? The bootcamp phase of the military given orders and how been expected to follow them very rapidly. That was already the expectation going in before the whole COVID thing happened.

So it didn't change my life, per se, but it changed what it looked like. But I was already going into that point in my life expecting to be told, Hey, you're gonna do this right now. You're gonna do this right now. Hey, today you have to have a mask on. Today you don't, today you have to social distance today.

You don't, I didn't know those were gonna be the things I was being told to do, but I knew I was gonna be told to do things. So in, in some aspects that it actually was a lot easier for me 'cause I was already mentally prepared to just have my life completely flipped around. 

 Katherine Jeffery:Yeah. That's so fascinating. You were already in the mindset Yeah. Of somebody else is gonna give me orders. 

 Brandon: Exactly. 

Katherine Jeffery: Now when we first jumped on and you said, oh my gosh, I have to be on Zoom, you said I'm permanently traumatized from Zoom. Talk about that for a minute. 

Brandon: A lot of my classes my freshman year we're on Zoom and the hardest thing about them was just the inability to learn.

You can tell very clearly who was in Zoom classes for something and who wasn't, because the knowledge gap is just incredible. And I look back now and it's dang, I was really, I was napping during that class. Like I'm gonna be completely honest, I was asleep. So anytime I hear Zoom, I just think inefficiency like, oh man, like we're not gonna get much done now. 

 Katherine Jeffery: And so when you think about we're face-to-face right now, right through Zoom, but would you rather be face-to-face in person then? 

Brandon:  Oh, absolutely. So much easier. And it's nice right now 'cause it's one-on-one so that works well. But we got twenty, thirty, forty, fifty people in a call and the bandwidth's being taken up, it's cutting out. You gotta turn screens off so you can get more bandwidth and, people are talking over each other, someone's computer's not working, someone can't present the slides.

You spend the first half of class just trying to get the technology figured out.

Katherine Jeffery: And is this just in class or is this in other areas of your life too, that you might prefer face-to-face? 

Brandon: I, for the most part have only really had experienced zoom through class. Most of my stuff has been face-to-face.

Military doesn't utilize at least not at my level. Maybe higher up when leaders have to communicate across the world, they might use it more, but where I'm at yeah, if there's anything I need to be told, it'll either be sent through an official email or they'll just tell us in a, an actual briefing face-to-face.

Katherine Jeffery: All right. So then what's it like to be a part of Gen Z and be in the military? 

Brandon: Again, I gotta go back to the constant change. And obviously I only have context for my generation. I don't know if that's what it was like beforehand. Might have to speak to my mom about what the military looked like when she was in, but again, just the rapid change.

There's. There's always someone new in charge. There's always new data, there's always new information coming out. Obviously international relations change, politics change, and all those things dictate my life on a day-to-day basis. For example, pilot training has changed a dozen times in the last year.

We have a new syllabus every few months. So it's just, my life is just constantly here's something new, here's something new. And everyone's trying to figure it out. So the instructors are trying to figure out, we're trying to figure it out and, you just, you take it as it comes and you make the most of it.

Katherine Jeffery: And is that AI that's causing these changes?

Brandon: AI is a factor. Not as much in my life. In the future, pilots are probably gonna have to deal with that a lot. Most of the aircraft we have right now, it's still on you, the pilot to fly the plane. Our planes have older systems at the moment, at least the training aircraft do. So I have some job safety for the immediate future, I dunno, about 10 years down the road, but right now it's nice. 

Katherine Jeffery: That's right. Okay. So when you think about respect from someone who's in a higher rank than you are, what does that look like for you?

Brandon: So , I'll start with, in the military, a mentor told me once there's respect for the rank and there's respect for the person.

Because it's the military, you have to have respect for the rank. If they outrank you, whether they're the best leader you've ever had or the worst, they still have earned that rank and they've earned the right to respect that rank entails. And then on the separate side, there's rank for that person.

And this comes from how they treat others, how they lead their experience. For example, I am a lieutenant, I am an officer, but I'm at the bottom of the officer pool. So technically I outrank, our senior master sergeants who have 20 years of experience. But obviously if you have half a brain, okay, there's a reason.

They've got 20 years of experience and I have less than a year. So it's, there is this very interesting dynamic of yes, you have to respect the rank, but you also have to be aware of their experiences their competence in their job, and understand that just because they're either higher or lower ranking you doesn't necessarily mean that's any indication of how they're gonna do in their job and how they're gonna treat you on a day-to-day basis.

Katherine Jeffery: So there's definitely a clear hierarchy, but then there's nuances around each Absolutely. Person that you understand. And just so everybody knows, you went to the Air Force Academy, that was your path into the Air Force, and I think you also had some significant leadership roles while you were there.

Is that true?

 Brandon: Medium level leadership roles. The academy goal at the end of the day is obviously to develop us to be leaders. They try to put you in positions where the higher up in the class you get, the more of your younger classmates you get to lead. So you get practice.

At my senior year, I had a hundred underclassmen I was attempting to lead. Some days were more successful than others, obviously. That definitely was formed a good core of the kinda the basis of how I view leadership. 

Katherine Jeffery: What are some of the lessons or things that stood out to you as you're leading a hundred of your peers?

What was that like and what were you like, whoa this surprises me, or I really wanna do this better?

Brandon: One thing I was not prepared for, and in hindsight, it sounds so silly, but you're not thinking about it at the time, is everyone's their own person. Everyone has different stuff going on.

Everyone has different priorities in life. You have kids who they joined the military just 'cause they needed a way to pay for college, and they wanna get out as quick as possible. You have kids who wanna make it a 20, 30 year career. And one of the unique things about the military is you gotta work with with everyone, where they're at.

So it's maybe you're thinking, okay, I care about this for this reason. And another person, they care about it for a completely different reason. So trying to figure out what their reason is and it, everyone's got their own reason, but you can still use that reason and motivate everyone.

But step one is you gotta be aware of what it is, if you don't know why they're there, why they get outta bed in the morning, it's gonna be really hard to motivate them and get them to do a good job.

Katherine Jeffery: And so how would you adapt that also, if you're dealing with somebody who's a lifer versus somebody who, yeah, I'm just in this for the short time.

Brandon: That's the question, isn't it? And you're asking a person with very little experience, so I'm still figuring it out. Trying to learn every single day. I guess they give us mentors at the academy. They gave us people leadership roles with a lot more experience.

We had master sergeants, with 15 plus years that would walk us through. And if we had problems, I could go talk to them and ask Hey, I'm struggling with this person. Some of the ones I noticed, that were the best at dealing with those different motivations is the first step is you gotta to some level, you gotta know your people.

Obviously the higher you get up, the harder that becomes. When you get, start getting like the thousands of people under you it's really difficult to actually know what everyone wants. 

But when you're at the, at least at the smaller level, it is easy to have a general idea of where people are at.

And it's easier to motivate someone when you know why they're getting outta bed, because if you have someone who's thinking Hey I inherently just love the military, I love it. I just, I live for this, then that's easy to say Hey, this is what's best for the military. And you've got someone who maybe is they're there because that was the best way they could take care of their family.

And there's absolutely nothing wrong with that. So when you say, Hey, this is what's best for the military, they're like, okay, but what's best for my family? I came here to take care of my parents, take care of possibly kids, a spouse. So then you can kinda realize where they're coming from and what their priorities are, and you can help them too.

If you know that there's someone there that their main priority is their family, you gotta keep that in mind. For example, when my grandma passed away the major in charge of me, she was immediately like I recognize this is something very important to you.

And she was able to get me on a plane that night so I can make the funeral the next day. So stuff like that. Then it's now when I show up to work the next week, I'm motivated to give back and help her out. 'cause she looked out for me. Now I wanna look out for you. It's a super cliche saying we've got, but take care of your people and your people take care of you.

Katherine Jeffery: Yep. Yep. I think that's pretty standard, right? 

But a lot of people don't understand that and how important that is. And I think sometimes people are surprised to hear that exists in the military, so that's pretty cool. So can you share a moment when a leader earned your trust?

Not because of rank, but because of who they were. 

Brandon: Yeah. Like I said at the academy they try to give us these opportunities to practice leadership. 'cause obviously the end goal is to develop leaders. And obviously we make a lot of mistakes. We're learning. We're pretty bad at that point which is a tough pill to swallow, but that's the truth.

And I had one leader and we messed up and some people made some choices in my units that were not the proper choices. When they asked me to deal with it. I did not take the proper action. And what my leader higher up than me did is she, so this was now an actual not a student, but this was an actual major adults like family, all that.

She basically shielded my decision from the even higher ups, her boss. She took the blame at that point and then sat me down. I still got chewed out, but now it was, Hey, we can learn from this. I gave you the authority to make the decision to decide how to deal with these individuals that made that choice, knowing that you may not make the right choice, but I wanted to give you the chance to be the leader.

I could have told you what to do, you would've learned anything. So she got in trouble also from her boss. But then I also learned a lesson. If she had just straight up told me, Hey, go with decision X, not decision Y, I would've been like, okay, don't know y but perfect. I want decision Y. And now I was like, oh, that's why we don't do that.

Katherine Jeffery: Now you get it. 

Brandon: And that doesn't work. Yep. 

Katherine Jeffery: So she created space for you to fail and but she was there. She still had your back. She didn't abandon you in that. 

Brandon: Absolutely. Yeah. Which is, takes guts 'cause it's their job also. They're looking for promotion all outside of that.

They're looking to take care of their family and getting yelled at by their boss doesn't help 'em. So it's, it was definitely a. It took some courage, but I appreciate it. 'cause I would've never learned that lesson otherwise. 

Katherine Jeffery: Wow. She must really believe in you. 

Brandon: Ah, hope so. 

Katherine Jeffery: So how do generational differences show up around authority in your experience?

Brandon: So that's interesting ' cause I have a funny feeling the Generation Z that you typically think of when you say Generation Z is not what you're gonna find in the military. We probably align a bit more with what the older generations are used to. The very much show up, do your job, don't complain, go home, repeat.

Yeah, it's, it definitely Generation Z in the military. I'm gonna assume it looks different and I went to a military school, so I probably don't have the best context for what it looks like in other places. But like the whole like idea of I don't know, like taking a me day.

That's not something I'm familiar with at all. That you show up and do your job. 

Katherine Jeffery: Right, like that mental health day. Is that what you're referring to?

Brandon: Yeah. Yeah. It's not to say that the military doesn't care about it. Obviously they need you as a pilot to be in the best mind possible to do your job.

But it's definitely probably different than what you're probably seeing with other Gen Zs and different communities, different jobs. 

Katherine Jeffery: Yeah. What other stereotypes would you say, or I don't know, things that people expect out of Gen Z?

Brandon: Things I've probably heard is lazy maybe not motivated, not driven. I'm trying to think what I would say. I guess probably the main thing I've heard just from other people from adults is that our generation doesn't like to work as hard. 

Katherine Jeffery: And would you say that's true of Gen Z in the military?

Brandon: In the military? I would say it's not true. I don't know what the older generation in the military would say less. 

Katherine Jeffery: Fair point. 

Brandon: Yeah. So you might have to ask them what they think about all the young kids coming in. It's definitely easier to be motivated in the military when you've got this thing called the Uniform Code of Military Justice.

Yeah I have to show up for work in a uniform, looking proper every day and that's not really a choice I get. 

Katherine Jeffery: And it's a Sunday, we're recording this and you were just working on a Sunday, like you were in the flight lab, right?

Brandon: That was optional. That was optional. If there, if, yeah, if any leadership hear this, I promise I was not in a uniform. That's more just comes from I love what I do and I wanna be as good as I possibly can at it. So whenever I can, I'm just getting extra reps in studying. No different than studying for a test over the weekends.

Just 'cause you care and wanna do well on the test. 

Katherine Jeffery: Yep. Doesn't sound lazy to me. 

Brandon: I would say we're not lazy, but, lots of different opinions. 

Katherine Jeffery: Alright. So sometimes in the military things can get stressful or really busy. And when that happens, how do you like leaders to communicate? 

Brandon: Leaders that show up is always nice. Sometimes when things get hard, leaders can disappear and that just says oh, I guess we're not in it together. So leaders who are there, when you've had a long day and you still have to be there to get the mission done. And they're also there.

They didn't cut out from work early and head home. They're still there with you. That's always good to see that says, Hey, when we say the mission actually matters, we mean it, and we're backing up with actions. 

Katherine Jeffery: That's good. And then, is there anything that causes you to shut down or pull back during a conversation with somebody who's maybe higher up on that hierarchy than you are?

Brandon: Shutting down's not really an option. They're gonna get an answer one way or another from you. So you might as well just lean into it and if you did mess up, take accountability. If you didn't mess up, if you. Maybe still take accountability and just figure it out later after they leave.

Yeah, I don't know. I think it's probably like how anyone from any generation interacts with their boss. There's definitely a line. You gotta be professional. So if you feel like maybe you're about to cross that line you pull back. But other than that, you can't just walk away.

You gotta, yes sir. No sir. You stay there until they're done with you. 

Katherine Jeffery: Yeah. So I hear a lot of people, and there have been articles lately on the Gen Z stare.

Like, maybe I'm confronting you about something or asking you some questions and you just kind, I, 

Brandon: yeah.

Cut down. Be careful of that one. Big big part about pilot training. 'cause we're trainees right now I'm not really in a leadership role. I'm the student at the moment. You wanna be coachable. Yeah, you don't wanna shut down when you're getting feedback, even if the feedback is mean and hurtful, because then their immediate thought is gonna be like, okay, this guy doesn't care.

He doesn't wanna learn, doesn't wanna get better. You might be thinking, okay, this is the worst way to deliver that feedback. Of course I'm getting defensive, you're yelling at me and telling me I suck. But it's okay you still gotta learn. Still gotta learn. You gotta ignore the tone and you gotta hear what he's actually saying and say.

Okay. So taking accountability is the first step because then you're like, as a matter of fact, I did do that wrong. Crap, I gotta get better. 

Katherine Jeffery: Yeah. 

Brandon: I don't like the way you're telling me to get better, but I do have to. 

And then you definitely gotta make sure the face reflects that you're engaged in, that you are taking accountability and recognizing your errors.

Katherine Jeffery: I love that. And do you ever go off and process that somewhere? Or do you just take it, if I'm giving you feedback not in a nice way and do you just swallow it or do you actually go talk about it somewhere? 

Brandon: So I always write the feedback.

I get down immediately. And that's, I think that's pretty standard. If you're gonna feedback, if you're actively in the process of doing something, they're yelling at you. You're just like, all right, yes sir. Correcting immediately and then afterwards we always brief and debrief.

Obviously when you're at a plane, it can be hard if you got a lot coming at you, things come quick. So in the plane, you just take it 'cause it's, especially most of the time, it's usually if they're giving you feedback, it's. Pretty important, like possibly gonna save your life.

So just yes sir. Like fixing, I'm correcting immediately. Got it. Move on. And you can't dwell on it 'cause the plane's still flying. You don't have to get, just get to stop afterwards. 

Katherine Jeffery: You gotta so bigger you're doing. 

Brandon: Yeah, exactly. So it's, it is easy to just take it on the chin when you're actually on the plank.

So it's that happens. We gotta move on. 'cause I'm still going, like it's, the world doesn't stop. Then afterwards you get to the debrief and that's when you sit down and I always take out pen paper and write down the feedback they give me. Then however they delivered it, I can at least go back later and sit down and be like, ah, this is what he meant.

This is what he said I had to fix. Now I can actually think about how to fix that. Sometimes they give you a way to fix it. Sometimes they don't. Everyone's different. It's just different styles of teaching and reading. 

Katherine Jeffery: Yeah. So then when you write it down, you're taking the emotion out of it and it's okay, now I can process what they were actually saying.

Yeah. Like in the moment you're just responding. 

Brandon: And we try to keep it objective. Another cliche we have in the military is attack the performance, not the person. 

You suck at flying because you messed up X, Y, Z is one thing. You suck at flying because of who you are as a person is a different thing.

So it's nice when they say you suck because of X, Y, Z. 'cause then you go, ah, now I gotta fix X, Y, Z. Let me go work on that. 

Katherine Jeffery: Yeah. Yeah, I like that.

You've probably seen it before. A Gen Z employee suggests new software, but their boomer manager shuts it down with, no, we've always done it this way. Or maybe you've watched a traditionalist roll their eyes when a millennial colleague asks about working remotely. These moments create unproductive tension leading to frustration, dissatisfaction, and stress, but it doesn't have to be that way.

Work. Places don't have to be divided. That's why I created the Gen Shift e-learning course. With over 20 years studying generational differences, I've built over 40 lessons to help bridge the gap in life leadership and work. Enroll today and get 10% off with promo code, pod gen shift. Want to go deeper, schedule a free demo or book a workshop with your team to develop practical strategies for intergenerational success, visit katherinejeffery.com/elearning.

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Katherine Jeffery: What kind of feedback helps you actually grow and improve? 

Brandon: I mean it's always nice when they give you feedback about something very specific. 'cause that's easy. Like when they say, Hey you're constantly a hundred feet high in the plane. Then they say, I think it might be because of what you're doing with your power setting. I instructor one time just straight up say, Hey, every time you look up, I notice you have a tendency to pull your hand back, which is causing you to get high.

So it's really nice when they tell you like, Hey, I, you have a problem, here's the solution. I'm like, wow, that's wonderful. I'm gonna stop doing that immediately. Problem solved. 

Katherine Jeffery: Yeah. 

Brandon: Sometimes it's not as obvious. 'cause sometimes they don't even know and you don't know. They're just like, I know there's a problem.

I'm not sure why you're having that problem. And then that's when you gotta go home and think about it and be like, ah, what is, what's causing me to have this issue?

Katherine Jeffery: And it sounds like a lot of your feedback is when you're in the air. 

Brandon: Yeah. 

Katherine Jeffery: And so you're getting like real time feedback.

You're not having to wait for it.

Brandon: Oh yeah. And for me it's the sim right now, but if they're completely quiet, the whole flight, that means you're either, having the the best fly of your life or the worst? Usually wanna hear some level of talking. 

Katherine Jeffery: Yeah.

That's probably really disconcerting when it's just quiet. 

Brandon: You're probably thinking, man, there's no way I'm this good. There's no way. They haven't had any feedback from me yet. Probably missed something. Start racking your brain. 

Katherine Jeffery: Okay. So how do you figure out whether someone is dependable? 

Brandon: Dependable on the military, the biggest thing is are they showing up, doing what they said they were gonna do, like carrying their share of the burden? Honestly, probably like any job out there, are they showing up? Are they doing their work? And one thing we talked about dependable on pilot training is pilot training very much is, it's a team effort. It's completely a team effort. And the people that are dependable are the ones that are taking their time to help their teammates. 'cause it time's precious here. We have long days. Our work days are 12 hours. So when you've done a 12 hour day and you've got maybe an exam the next day and you're not entirely sure what you're doing and your friend's Hey man, come over study.

Not only are they helping you, but they're taking precious time outta their day to possibly do things that they need to do to help you. 

Katherine Jeffery: So I am hearing people who are in it with you. And you know they have your back. 

Brandon: Yeah, absolutely. You can tell real quick the ones who day ends, they immediately go home.

You don't hear from 'em until the next morning and the day ends. A big thing we try to do is share mistakes all the time because everyone makes the same mistakes. It's, we all do the same thing. Yeah. If I get out of a sim and I did something horrible, I throw in our class group chat, Hey guys just a heads up.

Don't do what, I just did that. 

Katherine Jeffery: Awesome. Okay. How do you all as Gen Z in the military, how do you talk about stress or burnout?

Brandon: Oh, no, this is a fun topic. I'm not sure what what I'm gonna say about this one.

Katherine Jeffery: I must have hit a good one. 

Brandon: Yeah. So dealing with stress, obviously it's highly competitive. It's fast moving, especially with the new syllabus. They just add it every single day. So stress, it's a given. Burnout's, maybe not as much of a concern now 'cause it's so quick.

It's the whole anyone can do a sprint now, just gotta suck it up.

Katherine Jeffery: Interesting. 

Brandon: But the stressful part of the thing is, part of the stress is just, it's intentional. It's a stressful job. They're gonna introduce stress to us now so we can get used to it. There's no way to make flying a jet in combat.

Not stressful. There's just no way to do it. So might as well get a little bit of stress now. So you learn how you react to it, learn how to deal with it. Some of it's necessary, some of it's intentional. And that's always been a part of every type of military training. And some of it just comes from the natural aspect of wanting to do well.

'cause it's, it determines the trajectory of your career the next few months. That self-imposed stress is probably what you're trying to get at. How do you deal with that? And again, I would say it comes back to the team thing. Everyone's stressed, everyone's going through the same thing.

Everyone's thinking, man, this sucks. I don't know what I'm doing. When you actually start talking to your classmates about it, you realize oh, we all don't know it. And then you can come up with ideas on how to fix it. The big thing I do is I have several friends who just, due to life, we're a couple classes ahead of me friends from the academy. And so today I had a a classmate of mine who's three months ahead of me. He went with me to the sim building and he walked me through all the maneuvers, told me about all the mistakes he did when he was doing it, showed me how to do 'em.

And like stuff like, that's amazing. 'cause when you're helping out your classmates, sometimes a little bit like the blind leading the blind. I think I know what I'm doing and I'm gonna try and tell you the right thing. But I don't know because someone who's already been ahead and has been like, yeah, I actually I do know that because I failed that and I got told very aggressively not to do that again.

They can tell you for a fact like, Hey, you're doing it right, you're doing it wrong. So that helps a lot. 

Katherine Jeffery: Yeah, that's incredible. 

Brandon: It really just comes back to taking care of each other. If you're not talking to your classmates, if you're just going home by yourself every day, maybe you're just that good and you'll never get stressed.

But odds are if you're just at least talking to your classmates, hanging out with 'em, working together, that's the best way to deal with it. 

Katherine Jeffery: Gen Z talks a lot about like work life balance, mental health awareness, these kind of things. And you're talking about no, I'm going into a career that's super stressful.

Like it's just the way it is. So talk about that for a minute. Was that something you just, growing up in a family of pilots, you just knew this was what you wanted to do? Or at what point did you say No I'm good with this. 

Brandon: So work-life balance is definitely still a real thing. You don't wanna get burned out and you wanna make sure you're taking care of the people in your life that are important.

It's just, it looks different being in the military, and this is something I was already exposed to growing up, so it wasn't like anything of a shock. For example the regular person, when they think work life balance, they probably think manageable. Eight hour workday. I get home, my boss doesn't talk to me after work.

When you're talking work-life balance in the military, you're talking more like months like, Hey, we're gonna have 3, 4, 5 months that are gonna be really stressful, then I'll get three, four months that aren't, 'cause my mom for example, when she deployed she was gone for nine months and there's no work-life balance when you're at war.

You don't get to just tell like the other team Hey can you guys just calm down for a weekend? I need a break. That's just not how it works. So obviously when she was gone her balance was all work all the time. If she got a little bit of time off, she could call us, call home.

But then when she got done with that and she got home from her deployments, then she had a ton of vacation days saved up. And so we, we did a summer of just traveling around everywhere as a family. And that was the life balance. So it still exists. You still get time where you gotta take care of work and time where you take care of your family, but it's definitely looks a lot different than what most people are probably used to.

Katherine Jeffery: And let's give a quick shout out to your mom. She had a pretty significant role, if I remember being a female pilot. You wanna talk about that real quick? 

Brandon: Yeah, she was the first female pilot in the Marine Corps, so definitely really cool. 

Katherine Jeffery: Very cool. Yeah. we don't wanna miss that.

You come from Legends.

Do you wanna talk for a minute actually about your parents a little bit and their influence on you. And why you all became pilots.

You all followed in their footsteps. 

Brandon: So funny enough, I didn't wanna be a pilot, my brother and I butt heads a lot growing up, and he said he wanted to be a pilot before me. And I was like I'm not doing it now. I'm not gonna do that. I wanna be different. And the Air Force my sophomore year in college, there was an opportunity for me to get a incentive ride.

So basically they just threw me in the backseat of a jet for a joy ride. And as soon as that thing took off, it's dang it, that's a crazy sales pitch. And you got me. I'm sold immediately. Like I get what my parents love it. I get what my brother loves it. You got me, I'm sold. 

Katherine Jeffery: Wow. And for everyone listening, your brother is your twin?

Brandon: It is my twin brother. 

Katherine Jeffery: It's not just a brother. It's a twin brother. 

Brandon: Yep. 

Katherine Jeffery: Now your fraternal twins, you don't look alike.

Brandon: Yeah. 

Katherine Jeffery: And then what about your younger brother? 

Brandon: Yeah I think he's looking at helicopters. He just started college, so he's got a few years to figure out what exactly he's gonna be doing.

But, if all goes well, he might be doing similar things to us. 

Katherine Jeffery: And do you see yourself staying in the Air Force? Or do you see yourself like becoming a commercial pilot or flying private jets?

Brandon: I get asked that question all the time, and my response is, I don't know.

I don't know my life is gonna look like in five, 10 years. I don't know if I'm gonna have different priorities. My contract is for 10 years. So that's a lot of time for my priorities, what I want in life to change. So who knows? We'll we're gonna take it, one day at a time and 10 years from now I might have a different answer on what I'm gonna be doing.

Katherine Jeffery: For sure. And when did that contract start? 

Brandon: It starts once I get my wing. So it actually has not started yet. 

Katherine Jeffery: Oh, okay. So you're doing your time 

Brandon: starting. 

Yeah. Hopefully it starts in may. That's if everything goes well and I do well, still got a lot of work put.

Katherine Jeffery: You'll do it. You'll do it. I have full confidence in you.

All right. What makes you then, in this fast-paced, stressful career path you're on, what makes you feel supported? When the pace gets heavy?

Brandon: Honestly the biggest support for me is just being with great friends and classmates who I know are doing the same thing and, if they're doing it, so can I, like people before me have done it. People have been going through pilot training for going on what, like almost a hundred years now.

They figured it out so can I, so I don't know. Just knowing it's hard work, but it's worth it. There's lots of other people who do it. Lots of people who have done it. That's probably the most of where my support, I guess comes from.

Katherine Jeffery: Yeah, like that comradery. 

Brandon: Yeah. Exactly. It's. You show up and maybe you're not having a great day at work. There's probably a couple other people that aren't having great days either. It's the military, it's not all that uncommon, but you're sitting there with your friends and it's still a good time.

You're still glad to be there.

Katherine Jeffery: Yeah. Then I guess my next question, what kind of training feels useful and what feels outdated?

Brandon: What feels useful and what feels outdated? That's a tricky one because it's hard to have that perspective with my limited experience. I don't know what is gonna be useful. And that's kinda the catch 20 of training is a, you don't know what works until unfortunately you're in a position where you have to use that training and hopefully it's going well and you're surviving.

But uh, we think about that all the time. The military is very forward thinking. We really do try to plan for our next conflicts. Not the previous one, which is always a challenge. 'cause maybe you have a good idea of what it's gonna be. Maybe you don't, it's you're looking to the future, you're trying to plan for the future and sometimes you get it right, sometimes you don't.

Katherine Jeffery: You think about those men and women who've gone before you, who have more experience. What are some of the things you really appreciate about them? 

Brandon: One thing I would say is I do love when they can tell you why something worked and why it didn't. That's always awesome when you're at the sim instructor and you're like, you're doing this you're doing maneuver X in a specific way, and they're like, Hey, don't do it that way.

Even though that's how it's written, do it this way. They tell you, don't do it that way because when you're in an actual plane and you try and do it, it won't work because of, the aerodynamics, the reality, whatever. Then they can actually tell you, Hey, I've been there. I've tried it that way, does not work.

So now you do get the actual, Hey, I actually tried that way of training and it works great. So do it that way, or don't. That's probably the best is when they tie their life experiences. A lot of 'em, they flew the plane. Same planes. You're gonna fly. We usually stay, I fly the same planes for decades out of a time.

So a lot of these instructors are flying the same planes. I hope to fly one day and they can tell you like, Hey, if you ever get to this plane, this aspect of training's gonna help you a lot. Don't ignore it. And that's awesome. That's always awesome when they can give you that.

Katherine Jeffery: Excellent. So you have an appreciation for experience. 

Brandon: Oh, absolutely. In the military experience, it matters a lot. It really does. 

Katherine Jeffery: Yeah. Yeah. Okay. Now we're gonna do a lightning round. So first answer that comes to your mind. Ready? 

Brandon: All right. 

Katherine Jeffery: Being in the military, coffee or energy drink? 

Brandon: Neither.

Katherine Jeffery: What is it then? 

Brandon: I try not to do caffeine just 'cause I get bad headaches when I stop. 

Katherine Jeffery: Okay. So you go for water. 

Brandon: Water or milk. I'm from the Midwest. I'm a proper Midwest Boy.

Katherine Jeffery: Milk. It does a body good. 

Brandon: It does. 

Katherine Jeffery: All right. Favorite Air Force aircraft? 

Brandon: Ooh, right now I'm gonna say the T six, just 'cause that's the one I'm about to fly. So it's gotta be the one I'm most focused on at the moment. 

Katherine Jeffery: Excellent. The Air Force stereotype, that's actually true? 

Brandon: Actually, true. We care about our quality of life a little bit more than other branches.

What does that mean? That one's, that's gonna ruffle some feathers. Yeah. That's, there's some people are not gonna love that, but it's, it is what it is. I come from a Marine family. I go home every holiday, and my brother and my cousin and my mom are always like, the Marine did X, Y, z to me the other day.

I'm like, man, the Air Force would never do that to me. That sounds awful. 

Katherine Jeffery: So you feel better taken care of? 

Brandon: I do feel a little bit better. 

Katherine Jeffery: All right. The stereotype that is absolutely not true. 

Brandon: Not true?

Oh man. I'm trying to think of one.

I can't think of one at the moment actually.

Katherine Jeffery: Nothing. 

Brandon: No. 

Katherine Jeffery: What would your mom or your brother? 

Brandon: Oh. I can tell you what my brother would say. 

Katherine Jeffery: Oh, yeah. 

Brandon: The sta stereotype that we're the laziest branch. That's what he would say. And I would disagree with that. I would say we work very hard.

Katherine Jeffery: Yeah. It's just different. 

Brandon: Yeah. 

Katherine Jeffery: Work smarter, not harder. 

Brandon: That's, yeah. Yeah. Something like that. 

Katherine Jeffery: Favorite part of Air Force life. 

Brandon: The people. 

It's awesome that I get to go to work every day with people that are doing the exact same thing as me. Most of 'em are like similar in age. You get some variety.

But it's cool. I graduated college and most people don't get to see their college friends anymore. I'm living with my college roommates still. I went and got breakfast with three of my college friends that I saw almost every day in college. And after we were done with breakfast, two of them.

Took me to the sim building and helped me learn how to fly some maneuvers. So it's it's awesome. We're all doing the same thing still. 

Katherine Jeffery: Super special. 

Okay. Least favorite, but you'll tolerate it. 

Brandon: Least favorite, but I'll tolerate it.

I don't love the amount of paperwork I have to do to travel internationally. 

I grew up in a family that liked to travel just where we were all pilots. It's quite a process to get approved travel overseas, which in the reason why it makes complete sense, which is why I say I'll tolerate it, like obviously it's for our safety.

That makes sense, but it's still oh man. It's just something about knowing I'm gonna try and go overseas and looking at that stack of paperwork after I was like, there, there goes a weekend. 

Katherine Jeffery: Yeah. Like you can't just spontaneously go, which would be easy for your family to do. 

Brandon: Yeah.

And that's what my family loved to do was just pick a random country. Now it's oh, can I get at least a two month heads up if we're playing something? 

Katherine Jeffery: Yeah. And your dad's a commercial pilot now, so you can fly super easily, right?

Brandon: Yeah. 

Katherine Jeffery: Most Gen Z thing about the Air Force? 

Brandon: We all have iPads. 

Katherine Jeffery: Nice. Most old school thing that actually works in the Air Force. 

Brandon: Oh, now I'm gonna talk about our GPS. That thing is old school. Oh man. I know. I think about my grandpa every time I have to turn that thing on.

Katherine Jeffery: Nice. 

Brandon: It gets the job done though. 

Katherine Jeffery: That's right. Just a few more song that gets you hyped before a big day. 

Brandon: I'm trying to think what's my go-to hype song. Probably like any queen that was, that's what my dad listened to a lot growing up.

So that's, I still listen to a good amount of that. 

Katherine Jeffery: Nice. I like that. I wasn't expecting that. Okay. If you could have dinner with any Air Force leader, past or present, who would it be? 

Brandon: Ooh, now that's an interesting one. Honestly, just about any of the leaders from when we were still a part of the Army, we were the Army Air Forces.

To hear how they're dealing with trying to develop their own identity while still being a part of a branch that had a very different philosophy. They're trying to develop their own kind of thought process. 

Katherine Jeffery: Fascinating. When did that happen? 

Brandon: So that was like World War II era.

Late late thirties into the forties. 

Katherine Jeffery: Okay. 

Brandon: The Air Force was actually still part of the army during World War ii and there was a lot of Army leadership who thought war should be fought one way. And then there are these new Army guys that are like, actually, let's try it a different way.

And that was very interesting time in our history, just trying to figure out what planes were. 'cause we're still figuring out what they were and how can we best use 'em. 

Katherine Jeffery: Fascinating. If you could sum up your experience as a genzer in the military in one word, what would it be? 

Brandon: Normal. I'll be honest, proud of this podcast.

I never really thought of myself as a genzer in the military. It's just the latest person in a long line of people put on the uniform and go to work. 

Katherine Jeffery: Love it. And are we gonna see you like in a top gun type of situation down the road? 

Brandon: No idea. No idea. I couldn't tell you.

Katherine Jeffery: Is that what path do you wanna be on?

Is that a path you've thought about?

Brandon: I actually, I don't know. That's actually something I'm in the process of figuring out this is about the time in your life where you decide that. So I'm kinda just taking each day, just one day at a time trying to figure out what's gonna be next and what what I'm gonna end up doing.

Katherine Jeffery: Yep. 

What a gift this conversation was hearing about the Air Force through the eyes of a Gen Z airman gives the rest of us something we don't often get an inside look at how the next generation experiences leadership, pressure, teamwork, and service. 

What stood out today was the simplicity of what they're asking for clear expectations, real communication, leaders who listen in teams that trust each other, not less discipline, not lower standards, just more humanity in the middle of it. 

They want relationship.

You hear that theme throughout everything Brandon says, that sense of community, trust and consistency, and leaders who know their people and actually support their growth in real time.

We also heard something that can get lost in stereotypes. Gen Z isn't trying to change the mission. They're trying to understand it, contribute to it, and belong inside it. And when leaders slow down long enough to explain the why, invite questions and build relationship, younger people seem to rise to the occasion. This episode is a reminder that every generation brings something important. And when we blend those strengths, organizations get healthier, teams get stronger, and people actually feel seen. So as you go back into your own workplace or leadership role, ask yourself.

Where can I bring more clarity? Where can I show more flexibility? And where can I invest in a relationship? Because that's where real generational connection starts. Thank you again to Brandon for the honesty, the insight, and the perspective. And thank you for joining us on the GenShift podcast. If this generation resonated, share it with someone who works with younger talent, leads a team, or needs a window into how Gen Z is experiencing the world.

I'm Dr. Katherine Jeffery, and I'll see you next time.